Get Them to Give a Fck
Doesn't it feel like no one gives a fck anymore? Well, good thing I have enough passion and lots of fcks to give.
Hear from Julie Wanzer, LEED AP, author of Get Them to Care, in her podcast series talking about business-to-business (B2B) corporate training topics such as: business development, marketing, personal branding, company branding, email newsletters and women's etiquette in business.
Hear from a range of guests including Julie's colleagues, peers, mentors, influencers and other people who give a fck.
Get Them to Give a Fck
Episode 105: “I believe in leaving things in better condition than you found them” ~Jessica Nuncio, Women in Construction
About the Episode
Julie Wanzer, LEED AP, hosts the "Get Them to Give a F*ck" podcast, featuring industry experts like Jessica Nuncio from Naranjo Civil Constructors.
Jessica, Vice President of Business Development and Marketing at Naranjo Civil Constructors, shares her journey from a kinesiology degree to a successful career in construction, emphasizing the importance of networking, personal branding, and continuous learning.
They highlight the need for mentorship and sponsorship, advocating for women to find their voices and embrace their unique strengths.
Jessica also discusses the role of the National Association for Women in Construction (NAWIC) in supporting women in construction and the importance of authenticity and collaboration in leadership roles.
About "Get Them to Give a Fck" Podcast
Doesn't it feel like no one gives a fck anymore? Well, good thing I have enough passion and lots of fcks to give.
Hear from Julie Wanzer, LEED AP, author of Get Them to Care, in her podcast series talking about business-to-business (B2B) corporate training topics such as: business development, marketing, personal branding, company branding, email newsletters and women's etiquette in business.
Hear from a range of guests including Julie's colleagues, peers, mentors, influencers and other people who give a fck.
About Julie Wanzer, LEED AP, Podcast Host
Julie Wanzer, LEED AP, is the author of Get Them to Care: How to Leverage LinkedIn to Build Your Online Presence and Become a Trusted Brand, and Owner of Business Rewritten, a marketing consultancy, with 22 years of experience. She also owns Get Them to Care, a training-based consulting firm.
Ms. Wanzer is a marketing strategist and trainer of various communication topics, including online personal and company branding, seller-doer business development best practices, and email newsletter workshops.
LinkedIn Connections
Host: Julie Wanzer, LEED AP
Guest: Jessica Nuncio
Company Links
Hello, everyone. Welcome to get them to give a fuck podcast that's right, already cursed on my own podcast. Don't worry about it again. Working construction, I do that a lot, but this is the podcast where we cut through the noise talk about real issues and get people to care. I'm your host. Julie Wanzer, owner of get them to care, consulting and author of get them to care. Same book, all right. Like name, same name, too. People with things to say to give you guys, the audience, actionable insights and first perspective on the B to B service industry. So let's get into it today. Obviously, I'm joined by Jessica Nuncio, Oh, I love you. And she is from, it's Naranjo, right. I always say that. Naranjo civil, yes, you're right, okay, okay. I'm like, Okay, wait, wait, am I doing it wrong? Civil construction, and, gosh, yes, I think we first met, oh, I think it was like 2021, ish, right? Or it was in the middle of the pandemic at an HEC event, right? You were there at a different company, and you were just networking and talking to everyone, and I'm like, I need to know this woman, the gravitational pull exactly the energy was there, and obviously we've remained in touch since then. But I'm going to shut up now. I'm going to let Jessica introduce herself before we kind of get into our theme today, which is, you
Jessica Nuncio:hi yourself. So yeah, my name is Jessica Nuncio. I work for Naranjo civil constructors as their vice president of business development and marketing. That's a mouthful. I feel. You know, it's pretty much everything. It's, I wear many hats in this job. It's BD, it's marketing, it's proposals. But it, yeah, it's been, I've been in the industry for almost 18 years. Stumbled my way through it. I actually have my degree in kinesiology. And at the time, you know, they got rid of the what's it called masters program, because I was going to go on to be a physical therapist. And so I was like, I don't have enough money to spend, drop three, $400,000 to get my PhD, to make $70,000 at that time.
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:So thank you. I was like,
Jessica Nuncio:personal training, working at hospitals, you know, doing. And when I became a mom, my business and sustainable provide long term, so I'm not, I just felt like I was hustling left and right. And so through my my stepfather is a petroleum engineer, and he has a lot of friends who are in the industry. And, you know, I think that's one thing, right is this industry is built on relationships. And I
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:was wondering 20% sorry, go ahead back to it.
Jessica Nuncio:My daughter's going on all these interviews, and she's like, Mom, how do I interview? And I'm like, I can't help you, but she's, I haven't had an interview really, in like, because it's just been network and so, yeah, start off with a civil constructor, literally as a receptionist. Wow. And, you know, three months moved into estimating coordinator. And I think because of my hard work dedication and my ability to learn quickly and always, like, I'm always wanting a challenge, I'm like, I don't know how to do it, but I'll figure it out. I'll figure it out. Let's do it. So just kept promoting, promoting. And so I switched firms a couple times. Got to experience various sides of the industry, and yeah, and then Jerry found me. I think it was until a few years ago, I really started putting an emphasis on my personal brand, and through LinkedIn and and I think I listened to you, you were speaking at an S and P s personal brand, and I got work on that, you know, and really leaning into my authenticity. And it was like, like started attracting like. And, you know, I am so grateful that I landed where I'm at, because it's just been tremendous. And everyone that I work with is is wonderful, so it's really helped me thrive, for sure, Jessica
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:and what I love about you again, I've talked about when we first met, that energy like versus like, we were definitely like, ding like, right? Girls, exactly. We are. We are biggest we can be your biggest cheerleaders, right? Biggest resource, too, right? Like being able to help each other. And as you were saying, too, it's all about networking, right? And the people that you know, and how you not use people, but you connect right people with other people, right? Exactly. And then that's how you're building a network. Thank you. Exactly. That's what I'm trying to say. I'm like, I'm doing this thing with my hands that people, yeah, exactly, can't see, but yeah, Jessica, between the two of us, we'll figure it out. And I love too, about your story, Jessica, how you even said, you know, you started out as the receptionist, right? And I feel like, unfortunately, as women, sometimes that is the role, right that you the entry point to construction. For me, I don't I wasn't necessarily receptionist, but I was the vice president's assistant when I first started at McGraw Hill construction, and was helping him write emails and managing his calendar, right? But in the midst of all of that, I was able to actually interview owners of buildings, contractors, architects who had worked on these beautiful projects. Oh, this is actually really neat. Like, right, exactly right that you didn't even know about, and I now claim myself as like a building nerd, right? Like,
Jessica Nuncio:don't you have your lead AP certification?
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:I do. Yes, very good. Yes. So I'm all about the sustainable part too. Again, of thinking about, like, Okay, how does sunlight affect where you place the building, right? I never thought of that right, or how we're using water, energy, all the things. So I caught the construction bug, right, and now a building nerd right my way up through the ranks too. But I liked how you said, you know, you're definitely a hard worker. You learn a lot. So how has that then helped you? You feel like, throughout your journey, right? Like, I know you had mentioned, okay, Connie coming up through the estimating stuff, but then there was a little bit of a jump between there and Jerry. So fill fill in that. Yeah, what were you doing? I felt that I've never
Jessica Nuncio:really had any formal training like I was, when I moved up into estimating coordinator, there was a temp girl who, like, like, I'm out of here. I quit, you know,
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:right? You're like, okay, and so there's no
Jessica Nuncio:SOPs on how to do that job. And so the estimators, the coordinator was, like, the the front end line of all estimating, right? They were handing out the RFQs and making sure the, you know, MWBE requirements were met, and the main filter of communication, obtaining bonds and stuff. And I was like, Okay, I I'm game. Like, let's do this. I don't, I don't know what I'm doing, right? Exactly, messed up plenty of times, and happen, but that's how we learn, you know? And my team was so patient with me and supportive, and they're like, hey, it's all it's all right, you know, no one died. That was like, Fine, you know, right? And um. And one thing I always told myself, it's like, mistakes are okay, but I don't want to keep making the same mistake twice. Yeah. So that was my goal, right? And so I would, I literally, like, just came up with the best way that I could to do that, to do my role. I made it. What worked for me and what was more efficient for my team, you know, really digging into my teammates and saying, like, Okay, what do you how I was, like, Jerry Maguire. It's like, Help me, help you, right? You know, what do you need for me? How can I make your job easier, right? And I really feel like that, that motto, having that, like, leaving things in a better condition than you found. And that's always been one of my, you know, kind of golden rules in addition and so, and I feel like in anything, I think a lot of women do this, but especially in the role of, you know, whether it's estimating, coordinator, marketer, BD, we're just helping others. You know, I'm not a technical expert by any means. That grows, but Right? I'm a connector, and so it's like, hey, if I don't know, I'll connect you with someone who can help you. Or whether it's personal, professional, you know, I fill in the gaps, you know. And I think that brings a lot of value to my team, to our clients, you know, whoever you're working with. So having that, that mindset, I think, really served me well throughout and then just giving myself grace,
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:yes, like, yeah, self judgment, yeah,
Jessica Nuncio:yeah. And, you know, there's a lot of talk about imposter syndrome, really, and I've come to kind of not like that term, okay? Because, tell me why I feel like. I feel like all it is is growing pains. It's okay. We feel those when we're being challenged to rise up, yeah, and all right, like, oh, like, do I have what it takes? It's like, you wouldn't be in the spot if you didn't have what it takes. You know, sorry, get over it. Yep. And keep on going. And usually, I think we all suffer from self doubt or like these, these things. You know, my dad used to tell me we're all conditioned by three things, religion, tradition and society. And so it's all this noise that's kind of coming out at us that we growing up, take on as our own, okay? We like, it's like our own self programming. And so to combat that as an adult now, because that could be really debilitating, right? And they can really, oh God, challenge you and hold you back where you're actually getting yourself or you're getting in your own way, yeah? So I overcome that by asking myself, okay, hold on, stop, take a breath. Is this true, like these things that you're telling yourself or other people? No, okay, then shut up. Move on, you know, exactly
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:right? Yeah, that ends it right there. Okay, yep, yourself,
Jessica Nuncio:right, yep, it is true, you know, have a slice of humble pie. Or what can I do to improve this, or whatever? So I think Grace and and just, just striving to learn. I am like a sponge, so I'm always reading books, your book, you know, it's like just professional development. If you're a building nerd, I'm like a self development nerd, books
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:me up, right? No, definitely. Well, I think it's definitely speaks to your strengths, Jessica, which is you mentioned before, you're a connector, right? And in order to connect people, you have to be a people person, right? So you have to kind of know those fundamentals of self development, right? How to apply them, not only to yourself, but then to encourage others to do so as well, right? Right? I feel like when I'm with you, Jessica, I always learn something number one, always, always learn something new, and then always have something to question to myself about, right? Like you were saying more of okay, is this true? You know, is this something that's coming from an external force, or am I just telling myself this? Am I getting in my own way, right? And it sounds so simple, but you know it, when you're in the moment and you're heated, it's hard time to step back and be like, Yeah, wait a minute. Is that true, right? Yeah, it's the simplest question. But if you don't take a pause, take a beat, I like to say, and actually think about it, you're probably creating your own problems, right? So,
Jessica Nuncio:right, get out our own way. Get out of your head. Yep, exactly yes, exactly
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:No. And I did want to touch on another point that you mentioned about the opportunity to rise, right? So we're here talking about women in construction, and it just so happens that this year's theme is together we rise. Okay, what do you feel like that phrase means to you as it applies to women in construction, together we rise. What does that mean to you? Jessica, you
Jessica Nuncio:know, I think it's and I love this theme. I went to one of those, you know, crafty places, yeah, and, and I built the sign, and the frame broke. So obviously I'm not grateful there. But
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:whatever, different podcast, right?
Jessica Nuncio:Totally different. But it has, like, this leap, and it put together rewrites, and that was before this theme came out. So I was like, Oh my gosh. So for me, it means, and I think, and we've talked about this right, where, you know, I think, like growing up in high school and stuff you're challenged with, you know, you know, girl, mean girl, attitudes or or people, regardless of, you know, male, women, man, woman, or whatever, right? Throwing you under the bus to get ahead, you know? And it's this dog eat dog kind of world. And I feel like, I think one of the things that you and I resonate with a lot is because we've both admittedly said we're gals, gals and we're guys, gals. Yes, yes, you know, yes,
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:very much. So yes,
Jessica Nuncio:and people and we, I think, like, you know, if we had a superpower, it's like, it's that ability to see potential in other people. So why wouldn't you want to level them up? Right? And Exactly, yeah. So it's like, you're just that person's mirror, you know, to show them their greatness. And so for me and and especially we're talking about it in in the Denver chapter because I'm the for Denver new WIC, right? I
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:would say that should have been part of your intro. By the way, I'm the president. I love it. I love it. Okay, continue. I'm sorry. Yes, as President, what are you guys doing this year? With that together, we rise a lot
Jessica Nuncio:of things, I think, internally. So there's been a lot of growth within us as a board, and I'm actually going to address the the members here this weekend, early next week, because we've kind of stumbled through a lot of things, just trying to figure everything out and figure out how to bring value to the members, because it's been kind of quiet, you know, In the past. So we redid our website, hired a gal to help me with Meridian, and so they are creating a whole events page where have a communication plan, because no one was getting these emails of events, and it's just kind of social media, and it was hit or miss. Yeah, so they're going to see a ton of changes that, you know, I've been busy this last two months on, on the back end, working on all that fast, of course, to bring more value to the women. Give them, you know, the professional development education, the networking opportunities that they need. And so again it was, is that? Again, that helped me help you. Type of thing. We saw a place where we could do better and so,
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:and I think that's fair, you know, again, the like, as you mentioned, the Denver chapter for new WIC has has had its ups and downs, right? Let's be honest. The it short not changed as much as it should have right to be more inclusive also. Thanks again. We're having a real conversation, right? I'm not sugar COVID, yeah, yeah, right. But I think to be the way that you've approached it, Jessica, and wanting to, like you said, bring value to the members. And what I'm hearing from you is that you're almost creating like a community, right for women in construction to feel safe and get the education and resources that they need. And to me, that also then goes back to that theme of together, we rise. Right? Yeah, can't if we're all spread out doing our own thing. Village. Yes,
Jessica Nuncio:exactly right. And we talk a lot about so one of the gals on our board is Andrea Jansen, and she runs ambition theory, and so she's heard about the difference between being a mentor or a sponsor. Okay, so a mentor, educates, trains, offers professional development, and that's where it ends, you know, Okay, interesting, whereas a sponsor opens doors so that person has a seat at the table, and so we're adopting that sponsorship mentality, looking for sponsors to support you in your own personal growth, as well as, you know, being that person to provide doors that weren't open for you in the past. So it's a give and take. And so I think collectively with Na WIC and just me in general, throughout my career, I think I'm always trying to find and it's funny, before I learned what that meant, I didn't realize already doing it. You know, see,
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:yeah, you're like, so there was a word for something I was already doing. I didn't realize that that was the Word, yeah, well, and it's true, I never thought about mentor versus sponsor that way either, right, in that context. So once you try to explain it, there was sponsor. I was like, oh, okay, yes, tell me more,
Jessica Nuncio:yeah. And I think the sponsor could be really anyone, you know, I for me personally, I think he saw potential in me. And when other people were kind of like, yeah, let the guys do it or whatever. Just just sit there and be quiet. We'll handle it, you know. And I'm like, all these great ideas, and we're not using them. And just the conversation with Jerry's like, I gotta have this girl on my team and and he lets me do my thing, you know. And they have this great back and forth synergy. And he pushes me, you know, hard. And then, and then seeing other women in my in our company, where I'm like, oh, Who's this girl? She's very important, you know, how come she's not a part of these proposal meetings, you know, Tanya or, yeah, an environmental manager, okay? Which environmental piece, by the way, super important in construction, right?
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:Start anything without environmental okay? Like all that. She
Jessica Nuncio:keeps it safe. So we are not, like, we pass inspections. You know, she's out there on the site. She's, you know, filing our permitting, just a rock star. And so, you know, when we're, when I'm writing these proposals, I'm like, I don't go to her, because she's the one writing this stuff, exactly, yeah, she's like, No one's ever invited me, really just and, you know, I was like, Oh, well, what? Come on. Come on. Yeah. Love it, yeah. So I think it's really important too, instead of this, like, again, where we're in self preservation mode or we're just focusing on ourself, yep, we can get a lot further if we take those blinders off and help each other out, because it's almost like this all Scratchers, your scratch mine kind of thing, and not intentionally, you know, you obviously genuine about it, but yeah, I think it just we can go so much further if, if we have that together mentality instead of Yes, solo
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:No. And I think you're 120% right. And what I've noticed, at least in my career, and again, me now having my business for 10 years, just 10 years, right? I'm like, Oh my gosh. Like 2015 I was a totally different person, exactly, right, like, what? But in thinking back on that, I think that unfortunately, women, historically, anyways, have not done a good job about coming together, right? Like we either pit each other against ourselves, right, or the men pit us against each other, right, especially in the workplace of, oh, well, she said this, and who said this, and it's like, stop, just, just, can we? Yeah,
Jessica Nuncio:don't talk to X, Y, Z person. Come to me. Thank you.
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:Exactly right. Let's have a conversation, right, where we can learn not only about each other, but learn why? Are we? Why are we? Why are we fighting, right? This is stupid, right? Like, there should be no need for this. So again, focusing on that coming together, right, and not being afraid to pull your resources, right? And, like you said, pull Tanya in to the proposal, proposal process, right? Like, right, that's a big deal. What's the worst that could happen, right? Oh, it might take you a little longer to write it, but she may have that perspective about, you know, a project that has same environmental conditions, right? That she's gone after before and already knows the pitfalls. So if you can address that, the proposal, yeah, you already are already solving problems and the job, yeah, yeah, that's where, that's where it comes in, right? Like, what do they call that? The Golden Nugget? Yes,
Jessica Nuncio:the golden nuggets, absolutely. I'm looping her in now we're adjusting our content strategy approach, and so we're including, like, quarterly white papers and case studies. And so I'm, like, an author on this and small brand, yeah,
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:right. Well, and I think too, it's, it goes both ways, right? It'll help her personal brand, but then too, it will make neuronal, civil constructors look good, right? So it's a win, win, win, win. Yeah, no, I love that. Well, okay, so now, and thinking back now over your past 18 years, right of working, what have you seen? How have you seen the role of women evolve over the years? How's that role evolve? Question? That's a
Jessica Nuncio:good question. I do feel like, and maybe it's just there's more awareness around it now. You know, I think for a long time, because if you think of just name WIC in general, right? It's been, it's been present for 70, over 70 years. Oh,
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:wow, see, I didn't even realize that. Okay, yeah, right. There's
Jessica Nuncio:this as through time, there's been more, you know, advocating, there's been more awareness around it. We're up a lot more. And so I feel like, when we're talking about what's changed, I feel like we're finding our voices finally, oh, you know, and we're advocating for proper PPE, yes, right? Hello.
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:We're all not built like a man, right? We've got these things, sorry, right? Or whatever.
Jessica Nuncio:Women will still work when they're pregnant. And that's that's about like a missing link with nawick. I'm like, we need some trades women in this group, yeah. And so I'm like, trying to pull where are they? Where can I find them? And come bring your ideas and your energy and stuff. We want to serve you too. And so, you know, one of my friends, she's, she's pregnant, she works in the field as a welder, okay? And, and she's like, is there any, you know, closing? I was like, oh, yeah, I got you here, you know, and I'm sending her all these things. But I'm like, well, welding, there's a lot of fumes you probably don't want to be right, yeah, exactly. Like, I never got that one, yeah, but, I was, I was excited to see that they do make clothing for construction for women who are pregnant. You know,
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:no seriously. And again, the fact that we even have to say that is right. Again, whole other discussion, but the fact that they're doing it that that warms my heart, right? Like, that's like, Oh yes, yes, no, for
Jessica Nuncio:sure. Yeah, yeah, for sure. And I think, um, and when I say finding, finding Own Voices, right? Because I think for so long, in general, right? We were always, and I'm sure I was raised, you know, to just, just be quiet, don't stir up anything, you know, just just be quiet, look pretty and be nice and
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:smile. Don't get to smile. Jessica
Jessica Nuncio:and, you know, and it's just like, I Well, it goes back to your top of the art, you know, almost like the art of not giving a
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:right, right, exactly like, why do we care? Right, what other people are thinking, right? And I feel like too this is something that at as myself, speaking for myself. Jessica, I was raised as a people pleaser, right? So you have to put others first, make sure they're comfortable all the things. And yes, that has served me well in my business. Let's not I. Let's not get it twisted, right, like I understand how to it, does it? It helps me get clients and develop relationships. But at the end of the day, Jessica, if I don't advocate for myself and speak up at some of these client meetings, right? Or if I'm at an event and I see something that shouldn't be happening, if you don't speak up, it's never a change, right? Like, what is it? The squeaky wheel gets the grease. Yeah, yeah. Come on.
Jessica Nuncio:Things I've learned through S and P s being on their board too, is that, you know, when we're talking about ideas, we're like, they want you to voice out if you have a disagreement or you don't agree with something like, speak up, because silence is a grant. And so that empowers. You agree with this, well, why? And you say, why? And we have a discussion about it, and, you know, and it's great. And so, yeah, I think that's probably the biggest thing that I've that I've seen over time, is just women finally finding caring as much, you know, calling people out when they're saying ask my mark on the job site or at a pre med, you know,
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:yeah, yep, no, it's, it's so important. And something that one of my friends said to me recently was that you have to teach others how to treat you, right? So if you're not actively and yes, exactly right, so yes, tolerance is good, but if you're not telling people, or you're not voicing when something makes you uncomfortable, or when it's not right, or you don't again, if there's a problem, right, just bring it up. Right? Say something, you'll feel better, and then that will teach that person, oh, maybe I shouldn't say that around Jessica And Julie, right? Or maybe just not at all, because it's completely inappropriate, right? There's also that lesson, but also like, but how would that person know that you're uncomfortable if you don't say anything, right? You have to teach them how to treat you, right? And then teach them to treat you respectfully. I mean, at the end of the day, that's what it's about. So, yep, yep, I bring that back around. So, so I've talked about the evolution. We talked about your journey, but I kind of want to hear more about you. Mentioned again, we talked about mentor versus sponsor, right? I know Jerry has been a big part of your life. But was there anyone else kind of, over the years that you feel like had a big impact on you and your career? Who would you say that person is? And yeah,
Jessica Nuncio:there's, there's been a few, actually, women that I, I guess I don't want to say the world the word idolize, but really, I was moved by them and what they were doing with their careers. I think it was like when I started paying attention to my personal brand online, you know, I was seeking out, like, okay, like, who's who's really doing it right out there that I want to kind of not mimic, but just who encourages me? Or, you know, yeah, well,
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:you would emulate. I think them, right? You'll want to be like them. It's not idolizing whatever. But no, I get what. You're okay, yes, yes, emulate them. I would
Jessica Nuncio:say Ali spray is one.
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:She's okay. Love Ali spray. If you don't know her, get to know her. She's
Jessica Nuncio:amazing. I just saw all positive things that she was doing, especially in the community, and that's like a big place in my heart is trying to figure out, you know, how to serve the community and everything that we do, not just personally, but with the businesses that we're doing, the projects that we're working on, how to really make it a full, full circle thing and serve others. And so she did that so so well, and she was, I mean, the epitome of what a connector is, right? Yes,
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:I was gonna say again, she knows everyone, right? And on top of that, she not only knows your name, she'll know a fact or two about you. She'll know something about your family, like she is just that type of person, but she does it in such a genuine way.
Jessica Nuncio:She's a hype girl, too. And I think what was great was I reached out to her, I don't know, over maybe a couple years ago, and I just shot her a message. I asked her to be my friend on LinkedIn, you know, and I poured into her, you know, I never, I never take for granted, because I think sometimes you're like, Oh, how's this gonna come off or sound or whatever? And I'm like, I've learned to just be genuine with my my my praises and or constructive criticism or whatever, but just be genuine and put it out there. Because you never know when people, people sometimes assume things, oh, she already knows how great she is, or, you know, right? Yeah, you never know. So I reached out to her, and I just pretty much said, you know how great I think the work that she does is, you know, is and what impact it's made on me. And so she responded well, following each other and then seeing each other at events, and we saw each other at the last well, it's almost a year ago, last May, at the S and P s awards, marketing Excellence Award, correct, yeah. And, and, I think being a Latina and, you know? And so I got the beauty of the Year Award. She got the Leonardo Award, which
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:I definitely helped you get with the writing, but you did all the work, but you were there for the beauty award. Like, so I was your cheerleader. Yes, the thumbs up. Like, yes. Submit this. Go for it. Do it. So, yes, hype girls, but you won beauty of the year. Totally deserved, by the way. Keep going.
Jessica Nuncio:Thank you very much. But, um, you know, we kind of stepped aside and we're like, all right, the Latinas and so, you know, so so she's my cheerleader in that regard, and and since then, she's really been a mentor sponsor, kind of in my life as well, because she knows that, you know, next phase, you know, I went through a lot of transition in this last year with my divorce, My daughter, you know, going into college, she's still living at home, but you know that transition, and now that she's not a little girl and she doesn't need me all the time, I'm like, what is I feel like I'm 18? Like, what do I want to be when I grow up? What's this next stage? But Jessica, that's
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:awesome. I will just tell you a really quick that's a gift, okay, that not a lot of people get seriously, like that second chance, or like to really sit and think, Well, what do I care about, right? What I want to do? So, yeah, I'm all here for it. I'm over here, right?
Jessica Nuncio:There's a mixed bag of different things that I want to do, you know? And all comes down to helping others, right? And so I don't know, you know, maybe in 510, years or so, you know, I've thought about starting my own business. I think you and I have talked a little bit about that, but you totally should totally or consulting work or coaching, you know, oh, my God. So who knows. But I love that I can have these conversations equally with my boss, Jerry and Ali, and they're like, we just want the best for you. Like, what does that look like? And how can I help you, encourage you, you know, and hold me accountable to things that I say or or ponder, even no definitely. And
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:I think Jessica, like you said, having those people that that you trust that make you feel good about sharing those thoughts and feelings, right? I think too many women, yes, exactly, they need that safe space in order to share, right? And so I would say, grab like, hold on to Jerry and Ally like for dear life, right? Because, right, they are rare, rare gems. And I wish there was more people like that. But, yeah, I really love how you you feel comfortable going to both of them, right? That it's not just one sided or whatever, that you can show up to work authentically, right? As your whole self, you're not hiding anything about yourself, right? I mean, see, we're being professional. But you know what I mean? Like, I mean, I noticed it when I worked in house, right? I was working in an architecture firm, and I was the only marketing manager, right, female in the in the group, and I just, I don't know, I noticed myself walking on eggshells, Jessica, and that's when I knew, right, like, it's just when you have to, like, tiptoe next to as you're walking by one of the principal's offices, because I know he's gonna, like, yell at you, or, you know there's always gonna be an issue there. I'm just kind of like, No, thank you. I don't want to live that way, right? Like, what am I doing?
Jessica Nuncio:Life's too short, exactly, right?
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:But had I don't know, I didn't say anything, though, Jessica, right? I didn't speak up, right? I had not found my voice yet, right? And as I was at that architecture firm that was, that was when I was kind of planting seeds to start my business. I had reached out to a couple people while I was still working there, and even hearing that like it was possible, right, to start my business, and then I didn't have to go back to this firm and walk on eggshells everywhere. I was like, Oh, my God. It was like
Jessica Nuncio:a whole new world, right? Like, yeah, exactly,
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:opened up. But again, it was one of those things where I had to get out of that uncomfortable situation, right? I had to first recognize why it was uncomfortable, right, right? And B then be like, Okay, well, what are you going to do about it? Julie, right? And I was like, Yeah, I'm going to start
Jessica Nuncio:my own business, right? And that was right. So I uh, like, starting your own business or just changing firms, because, like you, I was in a very similar situation. I was a company for 14 years, and it was that eggshell mentality as well. And I'm like, I am not going anywhere. And in fact, I no longer feel safe here, right, you know. So it's like, you know, yeah. And so I'm like, I don't want this for me. So what's next, you know, right? And so at that point, I wasn't thinking about, you know, my own business and stuff either. But then, ironically, it's like, as soon as I put those that energy out there, I had a recruiter hit me up and said, hey, we'd really like to interview you for this. It was a senior estimator job. And I'm like, I estimate conquer in our work, but I'm not a senior. Just started learning that a year ago, right? Talking about, like, yes, yeah. That was on the go. Yeah. They're like, we keep having a turnover with these estimators. Jess, you're not going anywhere, and you love a challenge. Let's teach you how to estimate. Like, oh, let me just dust off these math skills that I haven't used in ages, decades. But you know, again, I picked it up, and it was fine. I got it, but I would never identify myself as a senior estimator, and so I senior estimator. They're like, well, your resume looks really interesting, though, and I think you could bring a lot of value to this, this firm, and they're interested in you. So I'm like, okay, but like, what am I going to be doing?
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:Right? Yeah, you're like, I've made it clear. No estimating, no, done, right?
Jessica Nuncio:This is okay, but I'll sure. You know, I don't like where I'm at, so let's do exactly, explore. Yeah. And so they created a position for me, because they said, Well, what do you want to do? And I was like, I really like the proposals and the marketing BD stuff. And so they're like, Okay, we don't have one of those. We're outsourcing it. We could do that in house. So I'm like, okay, so they, like, created a position for me. And I don't
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:think I knew that about you. That's awesome. Seriously, like, but you know, because
Jessica Nuncio:guys do it all the time, right? They just follow up. That's true. So I'm like, Okay, let's do it, and then setting the bar higher for yourself, whether that's, you know, the salary, or whether you want the work life balance or a culture, you know? And so for me, when I left that other firm, I was like, okay, because it was like, grow, grow, grow, grow, pedal to the metal. And I'm like, I am tired right now. That company, that company, was a startup company, they grew like, 3,000%
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:and insane, you know,
Jessica Nuncio:it was a lot of growing pain in those two years. And like, I don't want to do this, so I wanted to go back to civil and back to more of that kind of mom and pop shop. But at that point, I said it was really important for me because of everything that was going on. Yeah, so sure, politically, I wanted to align myself with either a woman or a minority. I think that's awesome. And again, like, as I put that out there, a week later, I get a message on LinkedIn saying, Hey, I noticed you're in the industry. You're part of SMPS, and I'm considering, you know, putting up, looking for a I'm like, Are you picking my brain, or is this a job interview? Yeah, exactly like, what?
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:How are we positioning words? Words, okay, okay.
Jessica Nuncio:Again, okay, I'll buy Yes. So I have a conversation, and it starts leading and feeling more like a job interview. And I kind of called it out. I was like, This is what Jerry Yeah. I was like, Is this a job interview? And he goes, Huh, well, well, not right now, but let's meet up for lunch on Friday. Are you doing anything? I'm like, Yeah, let's do it. And it was like a talk amongst friends like you, and I Yes, yeah. And I was like, so we doing this? And he's like, Yeah, let's do it, yeah, okay, right, sure, on board now, exactly I loved it.
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:Well, I I'm hearing a theme though, Jessica, between those kind of two milestones, right? Those pivot points, right? Prayer, where it could have gone, you know, sideways, or whatever else. What I heard from you is that you took a chance to talk to that recruiter. You didn't have to have the conversation with this random person on LinkedIn, right, right. Like, I mean, not that Jerry was random, but you know what I mean? Like, yeah, everyone knows Jerry also, by the way, in the AEC, Colorado, so it's not like a total stranger, right? It wasn't stranger danger for you, right? Like just contacting you, but still, you could have said no, you could have ignored the message, but you didn't. You said Yes, right? Like you took a chance, listening
Jessica Nuncio:to my instinct too. Yes, there's other opportunities that came across where I said, No, really. Okay, so you were like, before that, or, as I've been with neuron Ho, you know, I've had other opportunities land, you know, again, through LinkedIn and sure, and I'm just like, No, I'm actually happy where I'm at. I'm hard pass nice, you know, right? So there's a lot of where I'm at now, which makes me happy?
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:Well, I will have to say, Jess like, again, I've known you for a few years right now, talking
Jessica Nuncio:to you in this moment,
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:seriously, like you were the happiest. Like, talking not only about your career, your personal life, gosh, you even mentioned divorce in there, right? And nothing phases. You're like, well, I got this right? No, it
Jessica Nuncio:was, it was awesome. Again, I'm hyping Jerry up, but, um, yes, you know he's and I feel like I have that same thing. You have the same we call it a sign, you know, on our it's like we're very open, like we it's important for me that when people are in my presence, that they feel safe, and they can tell me anything, yes, you know, and that I will hold space for them in addition to anything that they're going through. And Jerry's that way. You're that way. And so when you have those two type of people, there's a lot of stuff. There's like, oh, I can be vulnerable with you. Okay, well, let me just take off on my mask,
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:and let's get real.
Jessica Nuncio:Here we go, Yes, and I left that, my God, I just told him my, like, whole life story to my boss, you know, was like, you know, but it's like he held that space for me, and, you know, like, I've been through some shit and hard shit and, and so going through this divorce, he was like, You got this Jess, he's like, hasn't life taught you you're undefeated? He's like, you've been through worse. You can get through this, right? You know? And, he's like, and let me meet along the way. And, you know, yeah,
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:yeah. Well, and I feel like those people again, are so critical in your life, when you are going through the time shit right? Like you can't again the we're going back to this theme together, we rise. You can't go through shit alone.
Jessica Nuncio:No, I think you can. No,
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:exactly, right, and you have to be I well, I caution people. I say you have to be selective about who you let in your tribe, right? Like, oh, absolutely no. Trust your gut, like you were saying, right? That will just suck you dry, right? And then then you go home at the end of the day, and you're like, I can't do this, right? I'm like, you hit your max capacity, and I don't think anyone should ever honestly have the power to treat it that way, right? If someone is in your life treating you that way, maybe re evaluate, how close do you let that person in? Right? Like, if they're a family, obviously, totally but thank you exactly. But no, you're right. Better boundaries, right? Like, don't let yourself get to that point. But also to lean on other people, right? And know who you can lean on, what, who you can have those conversations with, because you're gonna need it right? Like, again, I know you've been through some very unique things in your life. But, and that's not to discount them at all, but I think everybody can Yes, right, different levels, right? And, you know, still being able to lean in to first, right, and then be like, Okay,
Jessica Nuncio:I can do this, right. I can fucking do this, yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah, right. Oh my gosh. I love
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:that. Well, kind of been kind of bringing it back around, because I know Jess, we could talk forever. I like, I got a couple more questions I did want to get through, because I'm curious to find out. I mean, obviously you've had a long spin of your career right within construction. What advice would you give to young women now that are looking to get in into construction? What would you say to them? What, what kind of advice would you have for young women now, I think
Jessica Nuncio:encouraging them that there's, there's room at the table for you in construction and on any level, right, from the trades to an engineer, an architect, you know, and I think just giving it a chance, I think sometimes that the construction industry still has a stigma of being unsafe, that is a turn off To some people, but now, when we're facing, you know, college tuitions and people
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:the debt crisis alone,
Jessica Nuncio:yeah, what the heck? It's awful, and it's like there's so much potential that and a doors that are available, where you can get free trainings and and zero college debt and make a great career out of it, you know. So I think just having them get, you know, encouraging them to give this industry a second chance. And the people that are in here are wonderful and and especially the women who will wrap you up and and mentor you and sponsor you, and yes, you along the way. And there's, there's programs, there's people out there and resources. So to make it happen, I think anyone could do well in this industry. So I think just yeah, just giving it a second chance, and yeah, that's what I would say. High school students, yes,
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:right? And they're, they're, they're the next generation, right? The Boomers can't live forever, nor can we, right, so we need to start them young. So what do you what would you tell those high school kids? What? What's something they usually say to them?
Jessica Nuncio:Yeah, well, so some, one of the things I spoke at an event was through na WIC. It was during WIC week, and they had, um, various high school kids and alternative schools and stuff come up. And one of the gals, you know, she said, you know, college isn't in my my future. I can't afford it. She's like, and she was a teen mom, okay, trying to make ends meet, and working and going to school, trying to finish school. And she says, I just like, I don't think there's room for me in this industry. I don't have a degree, because a lot of the speakers that were there had bachelor's degrees.
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:Okay, yeah, okay, yeah. You're like, you can't betray honey,
Jessica Nuncio:right? And so she said, she's like, she goes, Well, you're, I'm, I'm assuming you. I said, Honestly, yes, I do have my degree, but I didn't need it to get into this job. Thank
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:you. You're like, my degrees in kinesiology, guys,
Jessica Nuncio:I know, like, I didn't, I don't use that, right? I said, I started off as and I told her my story, and she was like, wow. And I said, again, if there's you could totally do
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:it. And so what I'm hearing is like, it sounds like there's some education that needs to happen, right? Like to let people know, especially young women, that you're right. It's not just the stigma of having to pick up a, you know, a hammer and sledge, . And I think too thinking back to when I was in high school, had someone told me that I would a, own, my own business and B, have it focused in construction, I would have told them they were crazy, right? I'm talking about there's no way that I would ever
Jessica Nuncio:do the
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:construction but I think it was because of that education piece and not knowing all the different ways that you can be involved in this industry, right? Like you were saying, estimator, whether you're in marketing or you're on that you know that career trajectory, right, to start out in the field and then become a superintendent, right? All of that is possible in construction, right? I feel like that is one of the strongest parts of our industry, is that there are clear pathways to get to the top, right. It's not like
Jessica Nuncio:my own adventure. Yes,
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:right, exactly right. Because if you don't like estimating, maybe you'll become a welder. And, yes, there's going to be training and and different things. But I'm at least, I'm finding Jessica now that I feel like companies, especially construction companies, are much more willing to train you if you just show up, right? Like, if you show
Jessica Nuncio:up and you're eager, yes, eager to learn missing, they don't want people to, you know, bitch and complain and give me someone who's eager, who has a drive, and I can teach them whatever, right? No, and
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:that's the thing that I feel like the sky's the limit, because, let's say you don't like welding. Well, maybe learn how to operate a heavy machinery, right. Like those, some of those tower crane people, they make over 100 grand
Jessica Nuncio:drivers, even, like, if you're, you know,
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:a driver has right, like it's so I feel like the world's your oyster. And I think we need to do, especially women, na WIC, other organizations, we need to do a better job of educating people about all the opportunity, the money, right, that's in it, like,
Jessica Nuncio:right? And the fact that it's not going as infrastructure, and it's a continuous thing, and it's an essential, you know, trade or industry. And I was joking around with my friends, because, remember those it was for like, Parks and Rec, or like, the fishing licenses, it was like, oh, hug a hunter, or hug a fish, you know, type of thing, yeah, like a hug a welder.
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:Well, I, you know, I just get what I what I found. And again, because I've done a lot of volunteering as well, like going into even middle schools, even right? To talk about construction in the industry, and what I like to do is say, Listen, construction and design is everywhere in your life. You could not wake up and brush your teeth exactly without construction, right? You could everything, get on the road and drive to school without construction. You wouldn't even have a school, right, without a house, exactly.
Jessica Nuncio:So it's
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:literally everywhere you look. And there's so much that you can contribute, right? And like you said, it's a it's definitely not going anywhere. I mean, despite, you know, the political like, what is it, all the steel tariffs and aluminum and all these things, right? Guess what? Construction will still survive, right? I think that women, obviously, we approach and see the world differently, right? There's no reason why we can't incorporate that more into construction. Do you see that, right, even with the civil stuff?
Jessica Nuncio:Oh, absolutely, I think, I think we do, and I think where it comes in is because I think women are a lot more focused on protect sustainability, yeah, advocating for, you know, more natural elements To our waterways and stuff, and then over time, as proven that that's the better way, you know, more sustainable these concrete channels everywhere in this concrete jungle that we live in. And so it's attracting more people, more recreation around the waterways and stuff. So in on my side, since we are so niche and we focus on river and stream restoration, I feel like there's a lot more women in these, you know, in the archive or even on the client side, that's a lot more women in these executive director roles. So it's really nice to see there's more collaboration. I've noticed,
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:yes, right? These jobs and no, very true. And again, we're being stereotypical, but stereotypically, right,
Jessica Nuncio:right? Yeah, women
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:are. We're great collaborators, right? We want to there. I think it's just something in our nature to ask, right, hey, are you okay? Right? Like, is there something wrong, right? Like, I think we're very intuitive that way, and that, I think that helps at least establish a foundation for collaboration, right? Like, if you're able to relate to people and say, hey, you know something's going on here, whatever it's personally, professionally. Let's address that first, right? Because you're a human being, and then bring that or bring those questions or that curiosity to the next meeting, right? Or the whatever, whether it's on a job site or in the boardroom, you gotta ask those questions, right, right? And build people together. It's the only way that you're going to get input from everyone is, if you ask, right? It sounds very simple, but
Jessica Nuncio:yeah, yeah, just do it.
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:Just ask. We are again, coming up in the hour. But any last thoughts that you would share about women in construction week, any last thoughts about the importance of women in construction and, yeah, how we can kind of come together a little bit more,
Jessica Nuncio:yeah? So I think, um, you know, when I think about women and and in those leadership roles, right? Because we're trying to create more room and space at the table, and I've noticed that there's like, two tracks of mindset where it's like, we have to think more like a man or be, you know, we feel like we have to adjust other people's visions of us or perceptions of us, okay, in order to get to that spot right. But I've noticed that the more that I stay genuine and authentic, then that creates, you know, more opportunities. So I think, as a woman in leadership, the world doesn't need you to be a replica of someone else. It needs you your voice, you know, your perspective, brilliance and you know confidence isn't about being louder or more. It's about trusting in your unique strengths and vision that only you can bring. Yeah, right. That I think that what may sometimes feel like a weakness might be your greatest advantage, and so to resist the urge to conform and just again, owning your authenticity, because it is your superpower.
Julie Wanzer | Business Rewritten:I love that. And honestly, that was like a Mic drop. Way to end this, like, I'm like, That was so good. I like, seriously again. I know you and I could probably talk for for hours, but I love that kind of leaving you with that point. So that is a wrap on this episode of get them to give a fuck. Thanks so much for listening. Investing your time with me today.
